TOD Jacket (2 jackets used in Temple of Doom including the ROTLA Prototype Jacket)

**Mac** · 05-06-2015, 02:56 AM

Originally Posted by neutronbomb

When he said it was not a jacket he made, it was because the film name 'Temple of Doom' doesn't ring a bell anywhere with him. That and apparently for no other reason. Not, "oh my god...I can tell by looking at the jacket and the leather of the jacket and the details of the jacket and the construction of the jacket or any other damn thing." No. Not because of the jacket itself per se. But because he just doesn't remember making any jackets for TOD in general. Same with Raiders. But, somehow that does ring a bell. "Yes. I remember I made them for Raiders. In general. Not because I actually remember making them or what they looked like or anything about them specifically."

This is what Peter said on COW back in 2003 regarding TOD jackets:

Originally Posted by Peter Botwright

PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2003 11:58 am

Yes it sure makes me feel old:
More facts:
I did make some jackets for TOD but not many, a french company made the top ups.
I did NOT make the jacket that Noel Howard has, I do not know where it came from but I beleive it is a french TOD.
Beleive it or not we still have the original makers
Peter Botwright- Designer and Pattern Maker of the Original
Bill Mole- Leather Cutter or Clicker ( official term) cutter of the original and still cutting.
Doris Scott: First prototype and Original jacket machinist and still machining Indy jackets
Georgie Shadwell: Original Jacket machinist and also still making Indyjackets.
Of course we have new blood but the Old Gang still exists.
Cheers
Peter

Someone else in that same thread stated that Peter had told them that he had only made a few jackets for TOD and the production needed more on short notice, so the producers had some made by a French company.

I’m not sure who originated the claim that the jacket was made by a French company, whether it was Noel Howard or Peter or someone else, but I would point out that in TOD, the ‘initial entry into the desolate village’ scene was filmed last during location shooting (using the Noel Howard – not made by Wested - jacket), while the ending ‘return to the restored village with the children’ scene was filmed first with a different jacket – with what appears to be much less smooth leather (possibly Wested.) That’s consistent with Peter’s assertion that later in the production they needed more jackets, beyond the ones he initially provided, so they sourced them elsewhere for convenience.

**Kt Templar** · 05-06-2015, 08:10 AM

He's only 70 FFS! LOL, Ms Nadoolman has her own time faded memories.

But I suspect there is a little misinterpretation by people talking to him over the years, I have known many Americans being befuddled by his very English (specifically East London) accent.

Not sure what you mean about the cowhide vs lamb, he has always said all the jackets were lamb. Specifically natural ribs and stretch marks on the Raiders. He only moved over to smooth nappa on the repros because that is what the fans wanted, because that is what they insisted they saw on screen.

**RCSignals** · 05-07-2015, 10:40 PM

I too wonder where the French company assertion comes from. Is it an assumption because of the buckles?

What are the differences of these jackets? other than the apparent tighter fit of one. (which flies in the face of the other claim that jackets were too big so a new tighter liner was made. I'm not sure that would be a practical way of resizing any jacket)

**neutronbomb** · 05-08-2015, 02:13 AM

Hey indydude18, The photo you asked about (see bottom of post) is of The Raiders Prototype Jacket. The same as the other photos of this jacket you've shown Vic wearing in LC.

There are many features that show the exact match, but to show one that also makes for a great contrast between the NH and The Raiders Prototype Jacket check out the top of the left sleeve where it joins the shoulder seam. There is a very, very dramatic vertical crease running downwards that can be easily seen in photos of this jacket. Contrast this against the NH TOD Jacket's top of the left sleeve. See how it bulges out and then cuts in sharply in a couple of places. Very different. Very telling. You can still see that feature still exists to this day in the NH jacket. Check it out in the second photo.

And yes, the Prototype jacket is the same jacket Terry used when dragging behind the truck. Check out the Prototype jacket thread when you get the chance which I'll now have to update after this discovery that you and knibs have helped to uncover

Originally Posted by indydude18

Comparison Part 4: I find no evidence in LC that the Prototype Jacket is used.

I have no photo comparisons for this part because I don't have a good shot of the Prototype jacket's pockets. If I had a good shot of the pockets, I could probably whip up a good comparison. I'm about 50/50 when arguing that the ToD jacket is the Prototype Jacket. I just don't see the same distressing although the pockets are almost identical. Is the Prototype jacket the same jacket Terry used when dragging behind the truck?

Now here's one just for fun! Can't tell if this is Vic or Jordi (Vic is more likely), but here's a good side shot of a ToD style jacket. There's no denying the tiny pockets, no brass snaps, and the ToD style collar. I don't want to use this photo for a comparison as it's such a poor quality, but if you guys see something I missed, give me a holler. I'd love to see what you find.

**neutronbomb** · 02-03-2016, 07:00 PM

Confirmed by Bob that Neil Cooper made the original Raiders jacket and 8 for TOD.
http://www.uswings.com/who-has-the-l...style-jackets/

**ba100583** · 07-05-2017, 06:10 AM

Hi all,

I wrote Star Wars Costumes: The Original Trilogy released in 2014 and worked extensively with the original Star Wars costumes in the Skywalker Ranch archives at that time. I've also viewed the Indy jackets in the Ranch collection there, and have examined several film-used jackets in private collections (including the Noel Howard jacket) first hand.

FYI the Terry Leonard "Truck drag" jacket exists in the Ranch collection. It has the smaller pockets and is similar in style to the TOD jackets but it did *not* appear in TOD. It is quite thoroughly thrashed, especially on the back where it was literally dragged along the ground for that sequence. Additionally it has a cut in the sleeve relating to the shot-in-the-arm gag. For that reason it would not have been used in TOD. In the collection they have two TOD jackets beyond the Noel Howard one that has been well documented - one is the "Jordi Last Crusade photo" jacket (heavily weathered; I don't know if this actually appears in TOD anywhere) and another is the other TOD jacket posted in some shots here--the one that isn't the Noel Howard.

No way the truck chase jacket was used in close-up in TOD. Always possible it was used for a stunt shot somewhere; I haven't taken a close look.

Brandon

**Indiego Jones** · 07-05-2017, 05:27 PM

Originally Posted by neutronbomb

Confirmed by Bob that Neil Cooper made the original Raiders jacket and 8 for TOD.
http://www.uswings.com/who-has-the-l...style-jackets/

Too much bullshit...amazing.

Originally Posted by ba100583

Hi all,

I wrote Star Wars Costumes: The Original Trilogy released in 2014 and worked extensively with the original Star Wars costumes in the Skywalker Ranch archives at that time. I've also viewed the Indy jackets in the Ranch collection there, and have examined several film-used jackets in private collections (including the Noel Howard jacket) first hand.

FYI the Terry Leonard "Truck drag" jacket exists in the Ranch collection. It has the smaller pockets and is similar in style to the TOD jackets but it did *not* appear in TOD. It is quite thoroughly thrashed, especially on the back where it was literally dragged along the ground for that sequence. Additionally it has a cut in the sleeve relating to the shot-in-the-arm gag. For that reason it would not have been used in TOD. In the collection they have two TOD jackets beyond the Noel Howard one that has been well documented - one is the "Jordi Last Crusade photo" jacket (heavily weathered; I don't know if this actually appears in TOD anywhere) and another is the other TOD jacket posted in some shots here--the one that isn't the Noel Howard.

No way the truck chase jacket was used in close-up in TOD. Always possible it was used for a stunt shot somewhere; I haven't taken a close look.

Brandon

THANKS FOR SHARING BRANDON!!!!
This fills gaps on the story.

At the Ranch, did you had the chance to see any Raiders hero jacket? Pictures ? (dreamer....)
How it looks? What about the grain and ribby marks?
It's dark brown, or more like chocolate brown?

Thanks again!!!

**xmasters** · 07-17-2017, 03:53 PM

Unless I'm missing something nobody suggested that the truck drag jacket appeared in Temple of Doom, just that the jacket might have been picked up and used as the pattern basis for the ToD jackets.

The Noel Howard ToD jacket does appear certainly in the end scenes of the movie for sure. You can clearly match up the distressing in close ups. The Noel Howard jacket also has a Bermans and Nathan label sown into it.

**xmasters** · 07-17-2017, 04:06 PM

Originally Posted by ba100583

FYI the Terry Leonard "Truck drag" jacket exists in the Ranch collection. It has the smaller pockets and is similar in style to the TOD jackets but it did *not* appear in TOD. It is quite thoroughly thrashed, especially on the back where it was literally dragged along the ground for that sequence. Additionally it has a cut in the sleeve relating to the shot-in-the-arm gag.

Interesting, but I don't believe the Leonard jacket is the same jacket Ford wears for the shot in the arm gag.

**Indiego Jones** · 07-18-2017, 03:34 PM

Originally Posted by ba100583

FYI the Terry Leonard "Truck drag" jacket exists in the Ranch collection. It has the smaller pockets and is similar in style to the TOD jackets but it did *not* appear in TOD. It is quite thoroughly thrashed, especially on the back where it was literally dragged along the ground for that sequence. Additionally it has a cut in the sleeve relating to the shot-in-the-arm gag.

Originally Posted by xmasters

Interesting, but I don't believe the Leonard jacket is the same jacket Ford wears for the shot in the arm gag.

I'll get it clear for you:

1) The Terry Leonard "Truck drag" jacket, is the same Ford is wearing at Bantu Wind pier scene. The very first scene filmed for the movie.
For continuity purpose, the jacket MUST have the shot in the arm gag.
After that scene was filmed, the hole must be sewed in order to be used as a stunt jacket in later filmed scenes.

2) The jacket Harrison Ford is wearing in the scene where gets shot in the arm, on the truck, is one of the HERO jackets (I pressume is the MAIN HERO)

Cheers.-