View Full Version : 000/888 Reboot

10-27-2010, 11:11 PM
Post subject: Tony Nowak Raiders HERO Pattern Replica #000/888 (tutorial) - Asiana Jones

"The Tony Nowak Raiders HERO Pattern Replica #000/888 was the 1st jacket that Tony made from the actual HERO jacket that he had obtained from a source that Tony promised would not be disclosed. Tony is a man of his word and therefore, I apologize, but I cannot reveal that information to you.

#000/888 is an exact replica of the HERO jacket worn by Harrison Ford during filming that Tony had in hand and was the first jacket he made period. If you order a Raiders Jacket from Tony and NO changes, you will get one made to your size based upon #000/888. Price is $975.00 for the Shrunken Lamb and $750 for alternative leather choices.

As those choices become available, I will update you with pictures, pricing, etc. Also, the run of 888 was not mandated by Lucasfilm, Speilberg, etc. It was Tony's decision.

This post has been created to provide you some in-depth detail about #000/888 as well as some photos at the end of this post. I will do my best to provide you with as much accurate detail as I can in this post. I took about 5 pages on notes when discussing this with Tony last week and he was adamant that we take a lot of pictures as well to provide you with as much information as we can. Also, the Replica #000/888 is NOT made out of Shrunken Lamb. It is in fact made out of Matte/Lamb and is actually the same Matte/Lamb that Binkmeister took photos of at Queen Mary. Tony didn't think to mention it at the time because he really didn't think things would come to pass as they have.

First off, many of you have asked why is it that Tony didn't just post/share pictures of the actual HERO jacket that he had in hand? The reasoning is quite simple.... The source of the jacket personally requested Tony to NOT take any photos of the jacket nor to share its origins with the public. Again, Tony is a man of his word and he abided by the source's wishes. Likewise, with the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull jacket that Tony had the opportunity of re-creating from an actual Last Crusade jacket that was sent to him, he was also asked to not take any photos of the actual Last Crusade jacket to share with the public.

What we can show you however, are the pictures of the actual #000/888 jacket that Tony copied from the HERO. This jacket matches Harrison Ford's sizing specs to a 'T'. I will demonstrate that at the end of this post for you as well in pictures.

Another thing that I want to share is that Tony and I are not official "gearheads" like yourselves. We are still trying to understand your passion to details and the 'art of screen accuracy'. So please be patient with us as we try to learn and understand your terms and viewpoints so that we can better answer your questions. Please be patient with us as we continue to learn and become a part of this community. We have a lot that we want to share with you as well in relation to all things Indy!!! And although we are not gearheads yet... we get it. What I mean by that is we are also starting to get the INDY bug and want to share our knowledge with you as well...

Tony LOVES his Raider's Shrunken Lamb jacket. Everytime I meet up with him, he's always got the darn thing on and is telling me about how its character is increasing everytime he wears it and breaks it in. Things such as how the jacket tends to slip off of your shoulders and how it drapes in the back when it does so. Also how the zipper and front panel curve outwards revealing the lining on the inside of the jacket increasing it's character. Honestly, I love my Indy Nowak jackets too, but I don't wear the thing everyday. I think he's just as giddy as some of you are with the same goofy smile that kids get on Xmas morning. He basically has also been stunk in to the universe of Indiana Jones!

Just as you are fans, so are we! We even have a couple of Steve Delk's Adventurebilt Fedora's each, although Bernie still has Tony's fedoras because he is personally going to bash them for him. These were being sent to Tony as a gift from Bernie, although Tony refuses to wear a Fedora because he thinks it doesn't suit him. When I first started communicating with Steve Delk, it was very apparent to me that he has a passion for getting the details correct, because he is a true Indy fan at heart. He strives to get all the details correct and stands behind his product 110%. I bring this up because I feel that Tony is also becoming an Indy fan, and will continue to bring that similar passion to his jackets for us as well.

The most important thing for Tony when creating his initial offerings after his #000/888 jacket were to come as close to the leather type, texture, feel, fit, weight, and color of the HERO that he handled. In his profession, those are the main elements of the appearance of a jacket. He didn't realize that COW members would be so detail oriented in their in initial examination of the Indy I jacket. He was basically trying to recreate the jacket and make it a better jacket in his initial creations purely because he wanted it to be more durable/functional while retaining the essense. However, he now realizes what COW members really want and wants to assure you that he can provide you what you want from #000/888.

Tony is also very adamant that the shrunken leather that he sourced was the closest thing to the HERO he had in hand. He actually went so far as to say that if no one believes him, thats fine with him. He doesn't care if he even sells another jacket.

Another interesting thing that I wanted to note was that when Bernie has intially provided Tony the Opportunity to create the jackets for Kingdom of the Crystal Skull, he actually had NEVER seen any of the Indiana Jones films. Bernie gave Tony homework and asked him to "watch all three movies while focusing solely on the Jacket, NOT on Harrison's Lips." (-As quoted from Tony)

BTW, please don't take Tony's remarks to seriously. He uses a lot of colorful metaphors, but he's totally respectful and is not hateful in any way. He's just got a different sense of humor. After all, he's Polish! (~Tony told me to post that...)

Tony basically knew immediately in the first 3 seconds of seeing the Raiders of the Lost Ark movie, that the texture and type of leather of the jacket was different than the Last Crusade offering he was asked to emulate. That's because he's worked with leather all his life. That is why he was so adamant about getting the right leather for his Indy I jackets. This is THE JACKET. Tony Nowak believes it, and Terry Leonard believes it.

In actuality, he assumed that he was the last one to know about the Shrunken Lambskin in Raiders. He assumed that what he was seeing on screen was exactly what all of us on COW were seeing. He assumed that we all knew that the Raiders jacket was textured lambskin. He was blown away when he found out that the experts on this board had been convinced otherwise and didn't realize initially that the leather was textured. Like I said, he has a strong passion for what he does and he saw immediately on the screen that the jacket was textured. Why anyone would dispute this is a mystery to us...

Regardless, Nowak is the most approachable person and told me to tell you to never stop speculating and he admires your dedication and attention to detail in this Indy Gear hobby. Even though he gets busy, he will always try to make the time to help you out in any way that he can, and he never wants to be disrespectful. I will also pledge to do my best in order to help answer your questions on the web since I am a little more adept on the web front. But please feel free to always contact Tony via phone to hear it from the horses mouth! He welcomes it. His contact information can be found on his website: http://www.tonynowak.com
Hopefully between the two of us, we can answer all of your questions in a timely manner.

Another topic that I'd like to discuss is the speculation around the 2nd Raider's jacket that Tony had in his possesion, the Leather Concessionaires [sp?] jacket. This jacket was NOT the basis for the #000/888 jacket that Tony made. In fact, this jacket was sent to Tony by a "Collector of Rare Antiquities" by the name of Robert Sparks [sp?].

Sparks contacted Tony from Hong Kong and asked Tony to make a copy of what he believed to be closest jacket to a Raiders screen used jacket. This was a jacket that actually had a tag that said, "Leather Concessionaires" on it. This jacket had a brass zipper and hardware (buckle/snaps).

Sparks asked Tony to make him a copy of the jacket that he sent. At the time that Tony received Spark's jacket, he notified Sparks that he was actually working on his own Raider's jacket and that it was made from an actual HERO jacket that he had obtained from a secret source. Tony told him that his HERO jacket actually had a silver colored zipper and hardware (buckle/snaps). However Sparks at the time believed that his jacket was a closer match to the actual screen used jacket...

Tony ended up making Sparks a copy of his original Leather Concessionaires jacket as he had requested, he also didn't want to hurt Sparks feelings in any way and to honor what he wanted done. Tony then sent back both the original Leather Concessionaires jacket and the copy of it back to Sparks.

I believe that Sparks is actually an active member of this forum, or actively reads the posts on COW because Tony said that after Sparks saw some of the posts of initial Raiders jackets purchased by members of this forum, Sparks then contacted Tony again and asked him to make him another Raiders jacket in the shrunken lamb. I believe that Sparks was also convinced that Tony had the real deal HERO jacket in hand as well. (~Robert Sparks, if you are actually reading this, please let me know if I have in any way misinterpreted what Tony told me during our conversations and I will immediately edit my posts. I tried to take very detailed notes from my conversations with Tony and have about 5 pages of notes and writer's cramp. )


What Tony is basically saying is that he was given the opportunity to make these jackets. He feels blessed that he is doing what he is doing and for the opportunities presented to him. "ONLY IN AMERICA!"

Finally, before I start posting up the actual pictures of the #000/888 jacket, I wanted to leave you with an interesting revelation that I had with Tony at the shop as we were trying to figure out what else we could share with you. I was trying to brainstorm ideas of what else will help get you the facts that you seek... Then Tony had a great idea!

We all know that Harrison Ford was sized up for a Kingdom of the Crystal Skull jacket that was very similar if not exactly the same as his measurements taken from the Last Crusade Jacket that Bernie had sent to Tony. Harrison Ford even tried on the old jacket from the archives and mentioned that it 'fit like a glove' in regards to his entire costume. I also remember reading a post from Patterson about Harrison still having a couple of his old movie jackets. Theoretically, Harrison's HERO jacket from Raiders of the Lost Ark should be very similar to his Last Crusade and Kingdom of the Crystal Skull basic measurements.

So Tony and I took pictures of the exact replica he made from the HERO jacket he had on hand, which Harrison Ford wore during filming on Raiders of the Lost Ark, and then we took comparison photos with Harrison's Crystal Skull jacket of any of the areas that we thought might be relevant for you to view and analyze.

Essentially, we lined up the sleeves, shoulders, the waist, the collars, the torso under the arms to the waist and snapped detailed photos for you to come to your own conclusions.

What we found was that the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull jacket that was made from Harrison's measurements that Tony made for the film seemed to be made size-wise for the same 'person' as the HERO Raiders of the Lost Ark Jacket that Tony had in hand. There was no doubt in comparing both jackets that they were actually made at different points in time for the same 'person', in this case, Harrison Ford. I found that very enlightening and hope that you do as well.

I also quickly snapped some pictures of emails that Bernie had sent to Tony as well.

I also decided that it would be a good idea to get some quick measurements of the actual #000/888 jacket in terms of measurements so that I could post them up for you. Mind you, I am NOT a seamstress/tailor, and I just took some quick measurements with Tony's help so they may be slightly off as I just eyeballed them, but I really wanted to get home because it was getting late so I kinda rushed it. I figured that you folks may find them useful:

#000/888 Measurements that I took:
Front Flap w/ Collar Stand vertically from bottom to top: 23"
Shoulder from sleeve seam to collar seam: ~7"
Sleeves from cuff to sleeve seam: between 25 1/2" to 25 3/4"
Back vertical length from Collar Stand to Lower back panel: 23"
Chest width: 22 1/2"
Waist width: 21 1/2"
Pockets: 8" x 6.5" (Crystal Skull Pocket for comparison: 7.5" x 6")


-Tony and Michael..."

10-27-2010, 11:12 PM

#000/888 Front View

#000/888 Rear View

#000/888 Inside Pocket Inscription

#000/888 Left Front Pocket View

#000/888 Right Front Pocket View

#000/888 Open Neck View

#000/888 Left Side View

#000/888 Left Strap View

#000/888 Right Strap View

Comparison of CS and Raiders Front Flaps. (Harrison's Specs) CS on top, Raiders on bottom...

Comparison of CS and Raiders Sleeves (Harrison's Specs). CS on top, Raiders on Bottom...

Comparison of CS and Raiders Shoulders (Harrison's Specs) CS on top, Raiders on bottom...

Comparison of CS and Raiders Back Panel Length (Harrison's Specs) CS on top, Raiders on Bottom...
Notice the CS has a longer back panel, and that the top shoulder panels are different... I think you guys refer to it as the Yoke?

Comparison of CS and Raiders lower Torso (Harrison's specs). CS on top, Raiders on bottom...
This is what I found interesting. They were identical in seam and pattern sizing... You can see that both jackets were made for the same person, in this case, Harrison Ford...

Comparison of Raiders and CS Pockets in open position (Harrison's Specs). Raiders on left, CS on Right...

Comparison of Raiders and CS Pockets in closed position (Harrison's Specs). Raiders on left, CS on Right...

Comparison of Raiders and CS Collar (Harrison's specs). Raiders on Bottom, CS on Top...

Raiders #000/888 (Harrison's Specs) on me. Front View. (I am 5' 10" tall)

Raiders #000/888 (Harrison's Specs) on me. Rear View.

Raiders #000/888 On me, Left Side Profile

Raiders #000/888 On me, Right Side Profile.
You can see how the jacket tends to ride to my back as soon as I lift up my arms... when I put them back down, the jacket stays slung back on my shoulders. The Crystal Skull jacket doesn't do that. It sits properly on my shoulders and the collar sits flush against the back of my neck. If I raise my arms, it still comes back and doesn's stay on my shoulders like the Raiders jacket does...

Comparison of CS vs Raiders on me FRONT View. (CS is my personal jacket, Raiders is Harrison's Spec)...
We wanted to show you how the behaviour of the jackets is different when worn...
Crystal Skull Front View

Raiders Front View

Comparison of CS vs Raiders on me Back View. (CS is my personal jacket, Raiders is Harrison's Spec)...
We wanted to show you how the behaviour of the jackets is different when worn...
Crystal Skull Back View

Raiders Back View

Tony Nowaks Personal Raiders Jacket.
The following pics are of Tony's personal Raiders Jacket so that you can view the Shrunken Lamb texture and color under the same lighting conditions as the other pictures posted on this thread...

Excerpt from PR material that Bernie Pollack sent to Tony Nowak. Bernie mentioned in the email to Tony though that some of the information wasn't what he had mentioned in the interview, so don't take it too seriously... There are probably some mistakes in the excerpt...

Personal Note from Bernie Pollack to Tony Nowak regarding his jacket construction, etc...
Thought that you might find it relevant or interesting to read...

Another interesting photo that Tony shared with me...
He actually made some A2 Bomber leather jacket replicas a while back for World Gym... This is a shot of some of the jackets that he made interestingly enough out of Shrunken Lamb!

To Conclude... some advice from Tony and I: Pop your collars!!!
I started to pop my collar on my other leather jackets and told Tony that I liked the look on certain types of jackets. And then at Queen Mary, he greets me with his collar popped up as well, as evident in most pics of Tony with a CS or Raiders Jacket on. Then Terry Leonard popped his collar during their photo op. Surprisingly to me, I noticed something in the Raiders of the Lost Ark, that all of you probably already know: Harrison actually pops his Raiders collar momentarily in the earlier scenes in the Idol Temple. So for all of you Nowak owners out there..... "POP THE COLLAR!!!" 8)

10-27-2010, 11:13 PM
The below from October 2008 is inaccurate:

Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 8:42 am
Patterson wrote:
I'm with you... I think I know where the confusion is coming from - too many gearheads in the kitchen asking the cook how he makes his white sauce...

From my understanding - mostly based on what I've been told by the individual who actually delivered two jackets at different times - there were two. One has a Leather Concessionaires label and one has a B&N label. I believe the quotes about which jacket was which has been transposed several times by understandably excited gearheads.

I was told by the "delivery boy" that the second jacket he brought was the hero. I did not get much more than that. Both jackets came from the same "collector" and the first was the Martin Grace jacket sold at Butterfields.

Many, many years ago I was told that there was only one jacket from the original trilogy that made it past Monty Berman's hands, and thus did not have the Leather Concessionaires label removed. Supposedly the hero was couriered directly to Deb in France, and the label was intact.

I'm getting this from other sources - which I have great faith in. If they were any closer to Lucas - to quote Groucho Marx - "they'd be behind him!"

Tony has been reluctant to confirm things. I'll make a call. Based on that outcome, I'll make an introduction for you Chris. As far as I know you have talked, but it may help loosen his lips on the phone if he knows you and I have talked.

Let's take a closer look at it:

"From my understanding - mostly based on what I've been told by the individual who actually delivered two jackets at different times - there were two. One has a Leather Concessionaires label and one has a B&N label. I believe the quotes about which jacket was which has been transposed several times by understandably excited gearheads."

What actually happened is first, faststreetsofhongkong (Robert Sparks) sent a Peter Botwright Leather Concessionaires' Indy Replica from the 90's to Tony to have a back-up copy made. Robert first contacted Tony about the CS jacket and mentioned he had a very old "Raiders" jacket and would Tony make him back-up copy. Tony agreed. Tony started making an exact copy of Robert's Leather Concessionaires' jacket. Sometime later Tony was sent an actual "Hero" jacket from the Raiders of the Lost Ark film. Tony contacted Robert and notified him that he had received an actual ROTLA "Hero" jacket. Robert responded by saying, of course I would like one of those. Tony then made Robert a copy of the 000/888 jacket and returned Robert's Leather Concessionaires' jacket to him. Robert also gave Tony the idea to use 888 as the number 8 is a lucky number in China.

The second jacket likely did NOT have a B&N label in it. Tony has stated that jacket had NO label in it.

"I was told by the "delivery boy" that the second jacket he brought was the hero. I did not get much more than that. Both jackets came from the same "collector" and the first was the Martin Grace jacket sold at Butterfields."

The above statement is nothing more than the individual who made it creating a story to "fit the pieces of the puzzle together as I see it (stated in Novemember 2009, Fort MacArthur". Which is interesting because he loves to give credit and verification to all those names we can see on the jacket write-up, but then mentions he was simply "fitting the pieces of the puzzle together as I see it".

Both jacket did NOT come from the same "collector". Robert Sparks owns the Leather Concessionaires' Indy replica jacket from the 90's and a studio executive completely, separately, and independently sent Tony the actual ROTLA "Hero" jacket that Tony referred to as "The Jacket that Counts".

Additionally, neither jacket was the jacket sold at the Butterfield's auction. "Hollywood"/''TCBcollector''/''Henry''/Dan claims ownership of the jacket sold at the Butterfield's auction. That jacket also has the appearance of one of Peter Botwright's Leather Concessionaires Indy replicas from the 90's, though "Hollywood" has stated he has documentation and personal verification from the Costume Designer for ROTLA that it is an unused "Raiders" production jacket. Here is the link where the Butterfield's jacket is discussed: Butterfield Jacket-Wested Replicas Discussion (http://www.fortuneandglory.org/index.php?topic=681.0)

The fact is, by his own admission the entire "Martin Grace's stunt jacket was sold at the Butterfield auction" is nothing more than Patterson just trying to connect the dots.

"Many, many years ago I was told that there was only one jacket from the original trilogy that made it past Monty Berman's hands, and thus did not have the Leather Concessionaires label removed. Supposedly the hero was couriered directly to Deb in France, and the label was intact."

The Leather Concessionaires' jacket that was sent to Tony by Robert Sparks was a 90's Peter Botwright Indy jacket replica. Again, apparently yet another made up fairy tale.

I'm getting this from other sources - which I have great faith in. If they were any closer to Lucas - to quote Groucho Marx - "they'd be behind him!"

LOL. 'The Informant!'

Different person than the one quoted above:

Posted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 5:40 pm
Chris_King wrote:
I don't understand why he told people that the Leather Concessionaires jacket was discounted when in fact it was THE hero jacket and obviously different to the Martin Grace jacket.

Mike wrote:
I think this can be attributed to me and Tony's broken English. I think Patterson and I worked it out later in the thread. I first reported that the LC-tagged jacket was off, but we think either Tony misspoke, or I misheard.

My bad.

For your later observations, I think you're more on the money. I think the timeline would be that the Grace jacket came first, then the LC one came in with "Frank."


No, you heard Tony correctly the first time. The LC-tagged jacket was off because it is a 90's Indy replica. The LC one did NOT come in with "Frank"; it was sent in by Robert Sparks/faststreetsofhongkong.

10-27-2010, 11:15 PM
Here are photos of Robert Spark's 90's Indy replica jacket from Leather Concessionaires (Peter Botwright/Wested) that was sent in to Tony Nowak before Tony received the "Jacket That Counts" as outlined in the previous posts above. Note the emphasized rounded front pocket bottom corners, double X-box stitching at the strap attachment points, NO thick leather ridge that runs along the top of the pocket flap (The movie jackets DO have a thick leather ridge), collar stand height, collar shape and size is totally different to 000/888, and aligned arm sleeve seams to Yoke seam:


Here are photos of two identical copies of this jacket (Robert Sparks 90's Indy replica from Leather Concessionaires) that were made. One out of Cow Mocha Cowhide and one made out of very, very lightweight lambskin.

Cow Mocha:

Lightweight Lambskin:

10-27-2010, 11:17 PM
I know of two fan jackets that were made with specs from the Leather Concessionaires Indy Jacket Replica from the 90's: Slydini's and Adam's from Canada:


Adam's (I only have photos of the collar stand):

I had the chance to talk to Tony's sewer and to closely examine jacket 000/888. The sewer refers to Robert Spark's Leather Concessionares' replica jacket from the 90's as the "original jacket" because it came in first. He is/was confused about the terms "original" as the second jacket that came in came in second and so he doesn't think of it as original even though it is the original jacket from ROTLA movie. Additionally, he made the 000/888 jacket based off the second jacket ("The Jacket that Counts") that came in. He says the second jacket that came in was in very bad condition. I noticed a few interesting aspects to jacket 000/888 and compared them to the pattern. The pattern exactly matches.

The collar stand on jacket 000/888 and on the actual pattern is 1 1/8" inches wide. However, there is a blue dot on the collar stand pattern at the 3/4 to 7/8" mark where the sewer makes all Indy replica collar stands. I asked him why and he said because that is what the Indy Fans wanted. I asked him about the replica jackets that were made with the "original"/Leather Concessionaires replica specs and he said he didn't really remember except that in the beginning he had a difficult time keeping everything straight.

I also asked him about another aspect of jacket 000/888 which is the distance between the arm sleeve seam to the yoke seam. There is a difference between the left and the right sides of .25". He said it was like that on the "other jacket" that he used to make the 000/888 copy. I didn't think to look at the actual pattern, but on a total guess I'd say the left and rights on the pattern are the same. I know my two Raiders jackets are. I'd suspect the actual pattern would have some of these types of things evened out.


Here's the collar stand of 000/888:

Compared to The Imam Jacket:

Here's the arm sleeve seam to yoke seam on the jacket's left side:

Compared to The Imam Jacket:

Here it is on the jacket's right side:

10-28-2010, 12:49 AM
I want to add this about the collar stand.

when I ordered my second jacket, I asked for it to be made to teh same size and dimensions as the original Raiders jacket Tony had to copy. Tony wanted to go over some things but at the time did not have the #000 jacket in the shop. Someone had asked to see it and he sent it out to them. He did that kind of thing.
Tony had to refer to his detailed notes. He said the #000 was nice to have but if he "lost it tomorrow" it didn't matter because from his detailed notes he could make another jacket exactly like the one he copied.
The collar stand was 3/4 to 7/8" as is the stand on my jacket.

I have since seen #000 but did not measure anything on it. The stand didn't look that tall to me, and an extra 3/8" should be noticeable.

Not that it matters much.

10-28-2010, 01:24 AM
Hey RCSignals, I remember you telling me that. The notes would be awesome of course. All I can say is I double, triple checked the collar stand measurement on jacket 000/888 with like 3 different tapes and rulers and then also the actual pattern because I noticed the longer collar stand on 000/888. And then I had Riley do it. Both the pattern collar stand and jacket 000/888 are at 1 1/8" exactly. However, the collar stand on the copies of the two leather concessionaires Indy replicas based on the faststreetsofhongkongs Leather Concessionaires jacket are at 3/4 to 7/8".

10-28-2010, 01:34 AM
Hey RCSignals, I remember you telling me that. The notes would be awesome of course. All I can say is I double, triple checked the collar stand measurement on jacket 000/888 with like 3 different tapes and rulers and then also the actual pattern because I noticed the longer collar stand on 000/888. And then I had Riley do it. Both the pattern collar stand and jacket 000/888 are at 1 1/8" exactly. However, the collar stand on the copies of the two leather concessionaires Indy replicas based on the faststreetsofhongkongs Leather Concessionaires jacket are at 3/4 to 7/8".

That's interesting, since Wested jackets usually have taller collar stands don't they?

The pattern will have seam allowance built in so flat it will look taller than the finished piece, could that be why it appeared taller?

Faststreet's Leather Concessionaires jacket has unique pocket flap seams compared to other LC jackets I've seen photos of. (I guess we have to be careful using abbreviations like that)

10-28-2010, 01:43 AM
I can easily see a 1/8" margin of error between both the Hawaii/Imams jacket Tony duplicated and the Hero jacket I've analysed here, and then from any one jacket to another. Given Tony also got the guage of zipper correct, we have a very handy scaled point of reference right next to the collar stand here. Notice 23mm comes to the opposite stitching, so allow another 3mm for that, you get 26mm - a tiny bit over an inch.


10-28-2010, 01:52 AM
Riley and I measured from the leather edge to the leather edge that extends past the actual top and bottom seam stitching to get the 1 1/8". It was the same for the entire collar stand.

10-28-2010, 01:54 AM
Yes, that's the same rationale that I used. My estimate wasn't seam to seam - it was edge to edge.

Was Riley able to confirm that Tony's notes tallied with this?

10-28-2010, 02:15 AM
Riley hasn't found the notes yet. There are tons of diary books to go through.

This is what I'm seeing on The Imam Jacket though Kurt. What do you think.

10-28-2010, 02:32 AM
Even The Prototype.

click and then click again for 100%
http://i615.photobucket.com/albums/tt235/neutronbomb_photos/ROTLA%20-%20The%20Prototype%20Jacket/th_bantu_collarstand1.jpg (http://s615.photobucket.com/albums/tt235/neutronbomb_photos/ROTLA%20-%20The%20Prototype%20Jacket/?action=view&current=bantu_collarstand1.jpg)

Look how the bend works compared to the above:
click and then click again for 100%
http://i615.photobucket.com/albums/tt235/neutronbomb_photos/ROTLA%20-%20The%20Prototype%20Jacket/th_bantu_collarstand2.jpg (http://s615.photobucket.com/albums/tt235/neutronbomb_photos/ROTLA%20-%20The%20Prototype%20Jacket/?action=view&current=bantu_collarstand2.jpg)

10-28-2010, 02:39 AM
Ah yes, the collar stand is kinking thus giving the illusion of it being shorter than it is and that there's a weird wobbly edge to the main panel's facing edge. But in reality it just the stand.

10-28-2010, 02:57 AM
The measurement i made of my jacket is from outer edge to outer edge, not stitch line to stitch line. Who would measure stitch line to stitch line?

Seam Allowance I mentioned would be the portion of material folded behind the 'finished' collar stand. The pattern will allow for that extra material.

The difference between 3/4 to 7/8" and 1 1/8" is greater than 1/8".
But the is a tolerance or allowance in garments, and 1/8" difference is a pretty 'tight' tolerance.
I've seen tables of tolerances for production jackets before (not Tony's jackets) and they can be as large as 1/2" difference +/-

10-28-2010, 03:53 AM
Ok, understood re seam allowance.

Yeah, I meant that there could easily be 1/8" variance with each copy - as you say, it's a pretty tight margin of error. So from Hawaii to Hero they could easily be 1/8" off each other, and another 1/8" from the Hawaii to 000/888, meaning that's now 1/4" if you know what I mean. That's the difference between 1 1/8" to 7/8".

Not bad for a guy in a metric country, huh? :D

10-29-2010, 09:22 AM
What a great thread! Thanks guys :)

10-29-2010, 08:26 PM
Yep. I second that.